User:Deb/Talk archive

Hi Deb,

I didn't realise you were a Coronation Street fan! I've just put in an entry for Granada Television which links to your entry. Arwel 02:32 Feb 7, 2003 (UTC)

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i have wist, sin i couthe meen,

that children hath by candle light

her shadewe on the wal iseen,

and ronne therafter all the night.

bisy aboute they han ben

to catchen it with all here might.

Are the above lyrics Welsh? BF 00:48 Feb 8, 2003 (UTC)

Attempting a rough translation: "I have known since I could [not sure about "meen"] that children have seen their shadow on the wall by candle light and spent all night running around after it, trying with all their might to catch it." It's not Welsh, it's Chaucerian English.

'meen' is the modern word 'mind' and, in this context, means 'remember' in Modern English. Mind is still used in this Middle English sense by Modern Scots speakers as in the sentence I mind his mither meaning I remember his mother. -- Derek Ross 16:31, 4 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Hi Deb, There is one more problem that has cropped up re use of names and titles, ie., how do you deal with someone who is universally known though the inclusion of a courtesy title in their name but universally unknown without it. A classic example is nineteenth century UK prime minister Lord John Russell. I've made a suggestion on the talk:naming page. I'd be interested in hearing your views. JTD 23:57 Feb 8, 2003 (UTC)

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I see what yoou're up to. Good on you. LOL Mintguy

Well, I was here before... er... Deb 21:37 Feb 9, 2003 (UTC)

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To all involved: Thanks for the help. The song was written by Delerium, musicians from Vancouver, Canada. After scanning Canterbury Tales I noticed it was medieval English style, and the translation by someone is correct. BF 03:52 Feb 10, 2003 (UTC)

Actually, although Delerium released a song ("Aria") which had these lyrics set to music, they were written by a group called the Mediaeval Baebes (their spelling, not mine :) for the song "All Turns to Yesterday" from the album "Worldes Blysse". The Baebes sing the words on "Aria", as well as their own "All Turns to Yesterday". illarion@lineone.net

Those two years of school weren't entirely wasted, then!

Deb, first minister is a formal name for an office. Surely in that case it should be First Minister, just as the UK is the United Kingdom, not United kingdom, and President of the United States isn't President of the united states, and Pope John Paul isn't Pope john paul. JTD 18:22 Feb 14, 2003 (UTC)

I may be wrong, but I think the name of the head of the government in Wales is called the First Secretary. The type of home rule in Wales if different to that of Scotland or Northern Ireland. There the Legislative Assembly is a law-making parliament, wheras the Welsh assembly isn't, hence if I remember correctly the different title for the Welsh first minister. (I think even the assembly's name is different too!) JTD 19:29 Feb 14, 2003 (UTC)

I've just checked and yes the Welsh first minister was called the First Secretary or 'Prif Ysgrifennydd y Cynulliad' (Section 53.1. of the Government of Wales Act, 1998) but seem to have been de-facto changed (though without legislative enactment that I can find) to First Minister (though both terms at different times are used in press releases and in media coverage. I know in British cabinet status a Secretary of State is higher in status than a minister, but in terms of home rule governments, the opposite is the case; a first minister is, you could say a Grade II prime minister - with less powers than a full prime minister, but still with with a position as heading an executive - whereas the First Secretary was meant if a prime minister at all to be a Grade III prime minister, inferior in powers and status to the First Ministers and with committee-style cabinet inferior in status to the govts in Scotland and Northern Ireland.

In Ireland, civil service heads of government departments used to be called 'Secretary to the Department of {name}' but because internationally at conferences they were often treated as being an ordinary secretary (one was notoriously asked what his typing speed was!) the position was renamed 'Secretary-General'. Something similar may have happened in Wales. (I'm putting a copy of this message on the talk page of first minister). JTD 00:16 Feb 15, 2003 (UTC)

yeah. Bill's quote should be somewhere. Tell me, on the issue of how to refer to football/soccer, do you think the solution is [football (soccer)]? (BTW, did you see the page I created on [Papal Tiara]? How do you think it turned out?) JTD 22:29 Feb 19, 2003 (UTC)

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No worries about the singer-songwriter thing. I must've made that awhile ago when I made a bunch of similar lists for various genres in the hopes of keeping list of rock and roll performers down to a manageable size. I actually could've sworn I hadn't made one for singer-songwriters. Tokerboy

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Hi Deb,

Sorry but I don't understand your qualification of the term Violinist. What is a non-classical violinist called? Enquiring minds want to know! :) Nevilley 00:20 Feb 28, 2003 (UTC)

--See User talk:Nevilley for response...

On the subject of violinists, the word "fiddler" is one often applied to someone who plays the instrument in a non-standard way - as jazz and pop musicians tend to. I know it's rather an old-fashioned term now, though. But you rarely (or do I mean I rarely?) hear, for example, the violin player in a pop group (another old-fashioned term, I suppose) being referred to as a "violinist". Deb 17:32 Feb 28, 2003 (UTC)

Thanks for the response. I hear fiddler used in the classical sphere too though, although it is a somewhat informal usage. I honestly don't think, with respect, that your differentiation works as it stands. Certainly there is a shortage of usage at all in non-classical stuff, because they don't do that much, but I think it is perfectly normal to speak of a rock violinist, a jazz violinist (I certainly wouldn't call Stephane G anything else), a session violinist etc. I would not speak of someone being a rock fiddler, that would be very odd: jazz fiddler? hmm maybe but has odd resonances. The only field in which I think fiddler is normal rather than an almost-jokey, deliberately informal usage, is in folk music where it is pretty normal. But even then I would not be surprised to hear "Bosnian folk violinist" alongside "Bosnian folk fiddler", not at all. Bluegrass fiddler I suppose would be more normal than bluegrass violinist?? My view fwiw is that it needs a mild rewrite saying that violinist is a normal and formal term in most or many spheres, and that fiddler (or fiddle player, which is common too - fiddler sometimes sounds like someone who is doing what you'd like your toddler to stop doing while they are meeting the head of the playgroup for the first time, but I digress) is informal, jokey (or studiedly informal) in the classical field and sometimes used in some non-classical contexts, notably folk. Oh dear, I have gone on a bit. Nevilley 18:10 Feb 28, 2003 (UTC)

Right, I've had a go. Naturally my new version is superior in every way and any fiddling (oh hahah) with it will lead to flame wars, death threats, legal action etc etc. :) Nevilley

btw do you know the people who do the Historic Houses and their Families books, for Pembs, Cardiganshire etc etc? Sounds like your sort of department, judging from your user page. Just curious, Nevilley

they're at http://www.brawdybooks.com/ Nevilley 18:55 Mar 1, 2003 (UTC)

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hi, deb. I'm just wondering - are you the same deb as on a-i.com (http://www.a-i.com)? I think I called myself robot5005 or danielehrenberg there. - Anonymous56789 22:17 Mar 5, 2003 (UTC)

(Just in case anyone else is wondering -- no, I'm not.)

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Hi Deb, your vote is earnestly sought on Wikipedia Talk:Manual of Style (lists). As you know, Susan Mason is determined to change all the lists around to her way. The debate has been moved to this page and votes are earnestly sought. STÓD/ÉÍRE 21:23 Mar 9, 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb,

You missed an almighty row on the naming of the emperors of Japan. Not alone have they screwed up the naming system by producing names that are unrecognisable outside Japan, and refused to accept any mention of Japan in the title, Taku also created so many multiple redirects the whole thing is a mess. He changed things from Emperor 'x' of Japan, then 'x' Emperor, then 'x' emperor. There are redirects to redirects to redirects. One page sent me around in circles; I had to hit the edit page button to be shown any text at all. The whole thing is a shambles and I'm mega pissed off. Now Taku is trying on the Hirohito page to say that Japan isn't an empire at all but some sort of republic. I've culled the stupid line a couple of times but I won't be surprised to see him re-insert it. (*sigh*). So having turning naming rules on their head and screwed up redirects he now wants to screw up elementary political science definitions!!! Sometimes I wonder why I even bother! A pretty pissed off STÓD/ÉÍRE 19:42 Mar 13, 2003 (UTC)

merci! Most appreciative. I've busy messing around with photographs on the pages on Irish presidents. I came across one old photo of a cabinet assembled with the President of Ireland in his residence. Low and behold (an Irish expression) but didn't three of the cabinet themselves become presidents later on. So that one snap got me four thumbnails - tiny but useful all the same until I get something better. The picture is a pile of photographs a guy bought from the widow of the photographer. The photographer is long dead, his widow thought he had copyrighted them decades ago but she neither knows, remembers or cares. The new owner knows some of them belonged to an Irish newspaper group that went bust a decade ago, having sold some of its archives, lost a lot and had what was left 'taken' back by the original photographers, who raised the library in lieu of outstanding wages! (Hell, I've just remembered, those bastards in the Irish Press owed me money too, a whole £50!) So the Irish Press neither knows nor cares any more - it consists of two men (who sank the once great newspaper group!) who together form the board of the nominally existing group and still own three valuable titles, but which are useless to them because no-one will touch them as long as those SOBs are within 100 yards of them. So they have their AGMs in some toilet cubicle somewhere and award themselves 3 pennies in wage rises every quarter. So the guy who now owns the pictures says it is OK to use them. So that is what I have been doing all night - cropping pictures, downloading pictures, uttering expletives when they turned out so small and then thought of a new way to use them! Oh well. Time to go. Slán. STÓD/ÉÍRE 11:14 Mar 15, 2003 (UTC)

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Oh. when i was young i loved the US press. No more.

But that's not why I'm here.

Deb. I love your contributions!

No reply necessary. Arthur 03:06 Mar 16, 2003 (UTC)

I agree totally. I find the 'style' rule that lower cases words like 'king' irritating. It clearly breaks the rules of grammar. I often wondered where it came from and when I write my own books I make a point of ignoring that rule and telling my editor 'don't dare change that'. BTW, what is you view on using 'duc de Magenta' rather than Duke of Magenta for Patrice MacMahon, duc de Magenta. I originally entered the page under that title but Montrealais and Zoe are unhappy. I am a stickler for rules in some areas but it seems pointless to rename French titles that are so close to the english that their meaning is obvious. We always called him duc de Magenta in history classes, just as we said Comte de Chambord never [[Count of Chambord]]. Changing titles from their native language where their meaning is absolutely clear and on occasion pronounced almost the same seems to me a bit OTT. There are far worse errors out there on wiki. In addition, MacMahon's name is already a strange mix of french (Patrice) and Irish (MacMahon) - the english version should be McMahon. Having a french first name, Irish language surname and an english title seems to me liable to make a complete mess of his name. It doesn't bother me that much but I think it would be a pointless change when 'duc' is clearly 'duke'. Any thoughts?

(I see others are now complaining to Taku about the complete mess that is the naming of Japanese emperors now on wiki, BTW. People are finding broken links everywhere, but Taku still insists he shouldn't have to fix all the chaotic links everywhere he has created!)

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I'm sorry about turning Bernice Rubens into an English author, especially after all that English literature talk. Thanks for fixing my mistake. --KF 22:46 Mar 24, 2003 (UTC)

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I see The Cunctator is unilaterally changing slogan titles all around the place. Should be arrange a full vote on the Talk:slogan page? I've made my explanation for why we should use [[Slogan {name}]]. STÓD/ÉÍRE 21:46 Mar 25, 2003 (UTC)

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Deb, countless figures are known for their last name. It is quite common and regular for last names to be used to identify historic and pop culture figures. With that in mind, criteria have been laid out to list only those popularly known by a one word nickname, a one word first name, their only known name, a one word stage name or pseudonym, or a one word pen name. Liberace is the last name of Wladziu Valentino Liberace. Lichfield is the last name of Patrick Lichfield. Houdini is the stage name of Ehrich Weiss. Kingturtle 23:02 Mar 30, 2003 (UTC)

When the said person first came on to wiki, some wiki people compared the pages being edited to pages of previous infamous individuals and came to the conclusion that we were experiencing a charge of another of the Lir brigade. But as was noted by some people, the latest version (if that is why there are) was polite, helpful and constructive, leading people to presume that the renaming was a case of turning over a new leaf. But in the last few days, the person in question has turned up on pages and started numerous pointless fights, including that WWII page. They have revolved around lists, what should be on lists, not using titles, etc etc. (Sounds familiar eh!) It seems like a return to the SM, VC etc editing styles of deliverately and provocatively annoying people, usually with a screwed up understanding of the facts behind it. *sigh* It is also noticable that SM turned up and blanked 'her' talk page then disappeared again in the last day or two. In Irish folk mythology, we have a story called the Children of Lir. It seems like wiki has the same infestation. STÓD/ÉÍRE 20:01 Apr 6, 2003 (UTC)

Susan is acting the ass on the Bolingbroke page. Why is 'susan' still not banned? She was banned at Lir, banned as Vera, is causing rows all over the place as Susan and as Dietary Fiber. Adam shows no sign of changing his personality under his various names. He should simply be banned. At this stage, I'm not going to call him by any of his other names, just Adam. What do you think? STÓD/ÉÍRE 21:51 Apr 11, 2003 (UTC)

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Hi Deb, just added an image to Margaret Douglas. Usually I work in the german Wikipedia, I'm not so into english writing. Regards --CCD

Hello, my less irritated friend, not that Adam has gone (Allah be praised!). I've come across a few naming problems re senior clerics who are so widely known by {title} {name} that most people wouldn't have a clue what their actual first name was. I've made my suggestion for a naming convention re senior members of the clergy (specifically in this case Roman Catholic cardinals!) on the Naming Conventions (Names and titles) talk page. Have a look and see what you think. Slán STÓD/ÉÍRE 03:56 Apr 15, 2003 (UTC)

Shhh . . . listen . . . . silence . . . NO ADAM VANDALISM!!!! Yippee! STÓD/ÉÍRE 03:56 Apr 15, 2003 (UTC)

Re: non-fiction title - In America that is what is used by most media to lump together anything that is not fiction. Don't know why, but probably because its "fast-food."

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Hi, Deb,

Hope my e-mail didn't startle you. I'm unused to this communicating with other users and thought that was the only option I had. That's also why it took me five days to get your comment. Jfitzg

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Hi, Deb

Thanks for the hello - I'm new here and enjoying being here. If I'm going wrong, please put me straight on anything. As I saw your message, I was pondering tidying up the John Milton article - a short stub followed by an insertion from Schaff Herzog. djnjwd

Hi Deb,

apparently Arno has a 'thing' about renaming Russian royals in russian. I've had to revert his version of Nicholas II twice. I've gone through Tsar Nicholas II's children and renamed them also, as Tsarevich Alexei, Grand Duchess . . . It might be worth keeping an eye out for any revertions or changes in the area by Arno. He appears either not to know about the naming conventions or thinks they don't apply to him. i'll keep an eye on them too. I also renamed Nicholas II's mother Dagmar of Denmark which I don't think Arno will be too happy about. But that is the way she is staying, whether he likes it or not. And at 6.44am, with dawn breaking through my window, I'm going to bed. Oiche Mhaith ÉÍREman 05:39 Apr 19, 2003 (UTC)

I wrote a detailed note on his page explaining the rules to him so everything should be clear. Yeah, he seems a decent guy. He did rename all the monarchs on the Romanov page in Russian (aaagh!) so I am going to have to rename them. ÉÍREman 19:28 Apr 19, 2003 (UTC)

Deb, could you take a look at the abortion page? I had some complaints from people I know in both the pro-choice and pro-life movements who thought it ineffectual and lacking in depth. I did a rewrite and showed it to people on both sides, as well as basing the rewrites on an academic who have an NPOV course on the issue. All sides were very happy with the rewrite and said it had much more intellectual depth and raised what the academic in her course called 'thought points'. But Sirub is unhappy and keeps reverting to an earlier version that all sides who I showed it through think weak, unfocused and mediocre. I would welcome your views. ÉÍREman 19:58 Apr 19, 2003 (UTC)

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haha, i was just joking about Peter Blake's fame. :-) Tristanb 11:29 Apr 20, 2003 (UTC)

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Thanks for doing the dirty work of merging zealots' info into zealot. :) -- John Owens 17:00 Apr 21, 2003 (UTC)

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Despite my best efforts, I cannot find birth/death dates for John Gilpin. ;)

Hephaestos 17:11 May 5, 2003 (UTC)

Nice expansion on the Janet Suzman article. I had found that she was a "relative" of Helen Suzman, but not what the relationship was. Thanks. -- Zoe

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Berkhamstead is an orphan. Also, in which country is it? Would you be able to find an article or two to point to Berkhamstead? :) Kingturtle 06:48 May 14, 2003 (UTC)

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I don't suppose you would like to help me grap the election data for 2001 of the BBC website. Then get it all on to wikipedia? (as i am too lazy to do it all on my own) -fonzy

No, I wouldn't.

I decided to change the name in 'honour' of the new server. :-) FearÉIREANN means man of Ireland in gaelic. (I'm damned if I can remember of the word for man is 'fear' or 'fearr' though I think it is the first one.) It basically is ÉIREman in gaelic. Re the royal names: don't worry. I know you are just trying to get things right. I think we can be proud of the fact that for all the problems, royal titles is perhaps one of the best areas on wiki, where we have produced a high quality of accuracy of encylcopædic standard. FearÉÍREANN 23:10 16 May 2003 (UTC)

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Deb
I confess I can think of no historic mice<G>. But: with a name-change to List of historical rodents... what of the Little Gentleman in Velvet, the mole that raised the mole-hill against which the horse of William III stumbled at Hampton Court, eventually leading to the king's death? The Jacobite's used to toast the Little Gentleman in Velvet during the reign of Queen Anne (I wonder with what beverage?). Or perhaps someone will think of a historical mouse<G> -- Someone else 22:43 17 May 2003 (UTC)

Drat! A perfectly good solution ruined by oververification! I don't think there's a compelling need for "List of historical insectivores". -- Someone else 22:55 17 May 2003 (UTC)

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Contents

1 Anna Leonowens 1 Speedy deletion 2 Anna Leonowens 3 The Peerage 4 Thanks for fixing my English 5 Goodness Gracious Me 6 Welsh hat 7 Shetland archaeology 8 Charles Caroll 9 Paula Yates 10 My Name 10.1 Guest family 11 IRISH GREATS 12 good work 13 Robert Goddard 14 Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother 15 Standards of debate 16 Gilbertine 17 Hal - Henry V 18 The Desert Song 19 Eliza Doolittle 20 Roguish Ian McShane 21 Joan of Kent 22 Richard III 23 Mintleaf 24 Eleanor Talbot 25 Cymraeg 26 Dinah 27 Another World

Anna Leonowens

Hi Deb, where a place dominated by male scientists (professional and aspiring ones), it's refreshing to find a Wikipedian like you who is a woman and in the arts.

I just read Anna Leonowens written by you. You are an experienced writer, and it shows. That article features a distinctive style and is smooth in transition. Very descriptive. Just one thing, even though you briefly mentioned it, I couldn't gather why Anna left Siam:

Anna's departure from Siam was not, as popularly thought, anything to do with the King's death, and he did not plead with her to remain. However, she was in the process of negotiating to return to his court when he was taken ill and died. [end of paragraph]

You state the false popular belief, and the next and final sentence spoke of her intended return. But I couldn't find why she left. And a reference to when she left was found only indirectly in the middle of the next paragraph:

...in 1897, thirty years after she had left Siam.

Could you clarify? --Menchi 16:53 26 May 2003 (UTC)

I live in the absolute opposite direction of your sister. Western Canada. Never visited the eastern part, although my elder sister had always planned with me to visit there by train. But she won't get this chance for a long while, as she had moved to Taiwan and has settled there indefinitely. --Menchi 17:46 26 May 2003 (UTC)

Hello, Deb. I hope that wasn't a reference to me when you spoke of people not being complimentary about your Anna Leonowens article. It's very interesting and well written and all that (although maybe there are a few bits that deviate from NPOV), but I just thought I should point out that someone else's research doesn't agree with it... (If you don't know what I'm going on about, see Talk:Anna Leonowens...) -- Oliver P. 17:56 26 May 2003 (UTC)

WOW! You saw Ena Sharples in full costume? R-E-S-P-E-C-T!

FearÉIREANN 03:51 27 May 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb, I've noticed a problem that is arising over the opening paragraphs of many royal and papal pages. We use numerous styles, many of them illogical and a throwback to when wiki named royal pages by personal name not royal nomenclature. I've proposed a solution on the Wikipedia talk:Naming conventions (names and titles) page. Take a look and let me know what you think. FearÉIREANN 00:56 29 May 2003 (UTC)

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Hello, Deb. I see you created a nice disambiguation page at William Jones, which is all very good and everything, but you did it over the top of what was the page about the philologist chap. I don't suppose that if you do the same thing in future, you could move the page, using the "Move this page" option? That way, the edit history of the page is preserved with the right article. I've moved it across, but that resulted in your disambiguation stuff being mixed in with the stuff about the philologist chap, which is a bit of a mess, but I still think it's better that way, with the edit history for the philologist chap being with his article. Please feel free to complain about my actions if you disagree. :) -- Oliver P. 02:32 3 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. I would have thought that editing a redirect page was less trouble than editing any other page, because you only have one line of text to erase! And moving a page saves copying and pasting the whole text from one window into another, so I think it's nicer, even apart from the whole edit history thing... By the way, I've just followed the link to the Tregolwyn Book Reviews (http://tregolwyn.tripod.com/) site on your user page, and I was wondering if that was you in front of that church... Sorry, I'm just being nosy; you don't have to answer that one. :) -- Oliver P. 19:21 3 Jun 2003 (UTC)

'Tis I. Since the photo was taken, most of the tiles have fallen off the roof. Deb 20:00 3 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Aha! I like to know what people look like, you see... :) Shame about the church. By the way, this page is 32 kilobytes long; some browsers may have problems editing pages approaching or longer than 32kb. Please consider breaking the page into smaller sections. You can use "Move this page" to create an archive talk page if you want. ;) -- Oliver P. 12:55 4 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hi. Deb. Well I was originally going to write something about the Earl of Lucan who was in the Crimea (4th I think), but then decided to disambiguate the Lucans first. Then I disambiguated the Earl Spencer, Duke of Westminster and now the Duke of Wellington. So now I find myself on a mission to do this for all of the dukes, earls viscounts etc.. who are of any merit and probably those who arn't. I'm more than happy if you have any comment or corrections to make to either the content or the style of these pages. Mintguy 21:58 9 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb, there is a row brewing on the Republic of Ireland page. Put simply, we have an agreed template, structure and text. One user, Scipius, some months ago tried to muck up the page through ludicrous and factually inaccurate changes. In the end he was told to back off, that the consensus was against him. Now he is back, trying the same mucking around. He wants to remove relevant information he almost alone thinks irrelevant, change facts to his own inaccurate understanding of them, etc. He tried to ignore the consensus last time. He now wants to pull the same stunt again and highjack the page to introduce his own factually inaccurate version again. If you could visit the page and join in the chorus of telling him to stop messing the article it would be most appreciated. It took a lot of effort the last time (from a lot of Irish people who were furious at what he was trying to do!) to stop him. Every bit of help in stopping this nonsense before it becomes a full scale edit war a second time would be most appreciated. FearÉIREANN 03:24 10 Jun 2003 (UTC)

The current version is the version Scipius wants to remove and substitute with his own much shorter, less detailed and less accurate version. I re-instated the current version last night. It was the version prepared on a temp page and was generally agreed on. Scipius wants to turn the Republic of Ireland page into a page on Ireland and play down references to the R of I. We went through this debate months ago and this seems like round 2. Hopefully he won't revisit the issue but it took ages to stop him in his last attempted rewrite (which also included an attempt to rename the page to 'Ireland'). FearÉIREANN 17:20 10 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hi there Deb, just thought I'd point out that JTD's representation of me is somewhat off. You can see User talk:Jlk7e for a lengthier reply. It's a pity that JTD is not in a particularly cooperative mood, but I'd like to mention that my intentions and edits aren't anything near what JTD suggests they are. Thanks for listening. -Scipius 22:58 10 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Done! Why aren't you a sysop? Someone like you should of course be one. Do you want me to nominate you? FearÉIREANN 20:49 12 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Nobody's ever nominated me (sob!) Deb 22:43 12 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Deb, could you have a look at my comments on the talk page of Vere Gordon Childe? djnjwd

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Heh, thanks. I try, as you mentioned. :) Almost got me into trouble yesterday with George M. Cohan. - Hephaestos

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You've been suggested as a sysop and seconded on Wikipedia:Requests for adminship. Please tell us if you accept your nomination. --Eloquence 20:07 14 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Done. Have fun, see Wikipedia:Administrators for details. --Eloquence 23:33 14 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hey, fellow Sysop! *grin* Scupius is back with his agenda on the Republic of Ireland page *groan*. Feel free to drop in. FearÉIREANN 01:31 15 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hello, Deb. Welcome to sysop-land! :) -- Oliver P. 08:27 15 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb. Have you voted yet in Wikipedia Talk:Names in titles? I have been urging people to go for the standard format used in media captioning and titles, following the where what, when rule. The main alternative in the vote is to go when where what. (eg., UK general election, 1997 versus [[1997 UK general election]]. In any case, cast your vote. It is neck and neck. FearÉIREANN 23:21 18 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hey Deb, congrats on sysophood. Have fun! ilyanep 23:24 18 Jun 2003 (UTC)

Hmm. I'll try to resist the urge to tell you off. ;) Would you mind if I moved the Nicholas Ridley disambiguation page to where Nicholas Ridley (martyr) is now, in order to put the page histories back together, and then recreated the disambiguation page at Nicholas Ridley myself? (As I did with William Jones...) -- Oliver P. 15:58 21 Jun 2003 (UTC)

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Thanks for the help with Madeira cake, it looks delicious. I'll be sure to let you know how it turns out if I make one. - Hephaestos

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D'oh! That was kind of stupid, wasn't it? ;-) --Eloquence 16:27 27 Jun 2003 (UTC)

No worries! Thanks, Deb. Keep an eye out for me -- It's summer, and hard not to lurk. But you won't see any contributions by JHK. User:JHK

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In answer to the question you post on my talk page:

Yes, that is my original quote...hehe. Ilyanep 23:25 1 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb. There is a bit of a problem developing with User:Boots. In the interests of consistency, he is trying to rename all Portuguese monarchs to english. I have pointed out that most Portuguese monarchs are known in english by their Portuguese names and he agrees but still is going ahead renaming them anyway, rather than moving those wrongly named in anglicised versions to Portuguese. (eg, he keeps putting Pedro V as Peter V!!!) Could you try to convince him to stop? lol Sysop Deb. FearÉIREANN 20:42 2 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Meow -- You are correct that Boots is a cat, but Boots was trying to keep a low profile until he had to explain himself. Boots is definitely Siamese, and definitely is in no way an incarnation of any user from Canada or anywhere else who has been banned or has been under threat of a ban. Suggest you relax and watch the actions. Check out what I said to the Irishman and let me handle the changes. Boots 00:32 3 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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I do not delete comments from other users' talk pages. However, I do delete comments from my own talk page when I consider them inappropriate or offensive.

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Thanks for the feedback and copyedit of Jennings. If disambiguation ever becomes an issue then the natural alternative title is Jennings Goes to School. Regarding the political angle, were you aware that Anthony Buckeridge was an enthusiastic supporter of Michael Foot's direction in leading the Labour Party? -- Alan Peakall 11:22 3 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb, I changed Wolfe Tone back to Theobald Wolfe Tone. Technically his surname is Tone, but in common conversation Wolfe Tone is treated (wrongly) as a double barrelled surname. If people use a first name, they mostly use the full Theobald Wolfe Tone. So using the full full name is the most correct form. Wolfe Tone could wrongly be interpreted as simply a surname. I hope that clears it up. FearÉIREANN 18:33 11 Jul 2003 (UTC)

I just bought a digital camera, so when I get some time I'm going to go out into the streets of Lewes to get some shots to put up on Wikipedia. I'll get a picture of the infamous cliff with the Snowdrop pub at the bottom of it, and one of the castle. Mintguy

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Google test, "magenta de Vine" = 50 hits, "magenta Devine" = 450 hits, all of which seem genuine. Mintguy

I hope he was an entertaining guest, and didn't get too drunk, you know what these BBC types are like. Mintguy 21:37 23 Jul 2003 (UTC)

BTW. I took some shots of Lewes, but I was disappointed with most of the pictures. I need to go out and try again sometime. The Snowdrop was particularly disappointing. When the The Kiss was on display in Lewes Town Hall a couple of years ago, a new facade for the Snowdrop was built (out of plywood) which was colourfully painted and had at its apex a version of The Thinker with a pint of beer in his hand and with a legend which described it as "The Drinker". Unfortunately this had obviously fallen into a state of disrepair and been removed. There were too many vehicles parked outside the pub and no was obvious pub sign indicating The Snowdrop so it wasn't worth taking a picture. Mintguy 21:46 23 Jul 2003 (UTC)

I've never used the BBC's web search page before (I always use google these days), but I thought I'd give it a go with "Magenta de Vine" and it found a vast number of sites. I then put in "Magenta Devine" and it found only a paltry number. I would invesitgate further, but I'm off to bed. Night! Mintguy 22:37 23 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Thanx. lol FearÉIREANN 03:25 26 Jul 2003 (UTC)

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Deb, thanks for the updates/expansion on Perry Como -- I'm a generalist, and when I see a blank page I like to add something as a starting point for someone with far more knowledge than I.

--- Hey Deb, thanks for your thanks on Perry Como -- my father made us watch it when we were kids. I never have a problem with additions or better knowledge, so don't ever hesitate to correct me.

And it's good to know that I have some support, by you and others, on the one little thing about royal prerogative I wrote -- on blank page. I've given up on arguing with two, maybe three, gentlemen who are vehemently opposed to me posting anything whatsoever on the subject, they being selfstyled experts apparenlty -- and content with merely regurgitating what others have written. But I did go ahead and put up my own non-wiki page on the subject that is quite extensive after a modicum of research on the subject. If you want to see anymore of it, including my original post -- you can link from User:Hlavac

I view wikipedia as fun and a cool way to give some explanations about things people ask about, as I shall continue to do, knowing full well that others do indeed know more specifics. Have a great day.

It is Emanuel [1] (http://gdl.cdlr.strath.ac.uk/redclyde/rc008d.html) Mintguy

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Hello, Deb. Thanks for your note about the disambiguation page at John Ford. Yes, I agree that it wouldn't make sense to move the page in that case, as the content was being split between several different pages. However, I think it would be a good rule when moving content from one article to another to put in the edit summary "content moved from wherever". That way, people know where to look for the edit history, and authorship attributions. Otherwise people might get the impression that it's content you've created from scratch, and then that might be a copyright infringement. But fear not! I've put a note in the talk pages of all three articles, telling people where to find the authorship attributions. Well, I expect that's confirmed your worst fears that I'm only here to moan at you. ;) So in a feeble attempt to compensate, I'll add a note of praise saying what good work you've been doing on, oh, you know, all that stuff you've been doing. :) Oh, and I'm happy to hear that the church roof has been repaired. :) By the way, don't you agree that the article titles are ridiculously small now? -- Oliver P.

Oh, I meant the history of the article, not the history of the talk page. Damn, maybe my explanatory note wasn't clear enough... And okay, I'll give the article titles a bit longer before I start moaning at Erik again... -- Oliver P. 22:40, 6 Aug 2003 (UTC)

I know she said she would only drop in every so often but I would love to see her around more. :-)

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Since you appear to have the same opinion as me concerning the Daniel C. Boyer article, I wanted to let you know that I will be gone for the weekend, starting in a few minutes, and won't be able to "argue" with the others involved. Hopefully my opnion has been made clear, however, don't give up on it yet, I hope things will be resolved over the weekend, and I can come back and work on something else. Thanks, and good luck. ミハエル (MB) 22:17, Aug 8, 2003 (UTC)

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Thanks for adding the full name of A. P. Herbert. It was not given in the selection of Misleading Cases I have handy; and I sought it in vain through Google. -- IHCOYC 20:38, 13 Aug 2003 (UTC)

When RK comes back I want to nominate him for sysop (again) I dont ask for much, but I ask that you support his nomination. Sincerely-戴&#30505sv 23:05, Aug 16, 2003 (UTC)

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Hi Deb. Recently I'm become interested in creating pages to disambiguate the peerage titles of Britain and Ireland. I started out doing just plain disambiguation, but then ended up writing brief narratives about how the title was passed from generation to generation. There's no real standard format for these pages. Personally I hate the old format that Isis and Renata implemented on pages like [old Earl of Derby (http://www.wikipedia.org/w/wiki.phtml?title=Earl_of_Derby&oldid=1289138) and I've begun to use a format whereby I list associated titles, then have a narrative of the family history and then a disambiguation list or list of succession. See: Duke of Somerset and Duke of Hamilton I'm not sure everyone likes this format, and I don't want to go to the trouble of doing it too many times before it starts getting changed I think it's about time there was a wiki-project on this. I've been talking with user:Someone Else about this and he prefers a different format, see Earl of Castlehaven. Personally I think that a reader would prefer a narrative of the family history to a cluttered list. Mintguy 22:31, 18 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Hi. Thanks for you comments. Rolls-Royce solution sounds really cool :).

Ok I'm responsible for moving the young Richard Duke of York, please see my comment on Talk:Richard, Duke of York (prince in the tower). Mintguy 21:53, 19 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb, Re Mike Yarwood, I always spelt Palladium with two ls but all the websites referred to the London Paladium, so I presumed that must be the correct spelling in that case. (Or it may be that those who wrote the sites wrote them in the damned American english. But if you believe it should have two ls, that's fine by me. What do you think of the article, BTW? I was a little amused to find myself writing about Mike Yarwood and 1970s British comedy, even more so to find I could remember so much about it. It was a nice change from writing about royalty and politics! :-) lol FearÉIREANN

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Speedy deletion

Hello, Deb. About your message on Wikipedia:Votes for deletion:

"Try reading the deletion policy again. You don't have to wait if an article is obvious rubbish, as this one was."

Yep, I've read it. There's a section headed "Candidates for speedy deletion", with seven categories of pages that can be deleted without being listed on VfD for seven days. Michael Walker (headmaster) didn't fall into any of them. Not even close! Any page in the main article space that contains some meaningful content about the subject fails to satisfy conditions 1, 2, 3, and 7. Any page more than a sentence or two long fails to satisfy condition 4. That only leaves previously deleted content (not the case here) and pages created and edited solely by a banned user after they were banned (also not the case here). So even if you think an article is "obvious rubbish" (which this page was far from being anyway), you shouldn't delete it without listing it on VfD for a week first. It might be worth noting that I did little to the article apart from removing information from it, so if it has meaningful content now, then it must have done originally, too! -- Oliver P. 23:45, 21 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Hi. I've kicked of a Wikiproject page at Wikipedia:WikiProject Peerage, so discussion can be lumped together in one place :). Mintguy 10:19, 22 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Hello, Deb. Sorry if I sounded rude earlier. It seems that we have different interpretations of Wikipedia:Deletion policy. It's certainly true that Dr. Walker's page was less than entirely serious in tone, I agree with you there. But there certainly were parts that sounded like pure encyclopaedic material. "Dr Walker joined the History department at King Edward VI Grammar School (Chelmsford), and quickly took on head of year and head of sixth form responsibilities," for example, is a nice succinct summary of his early years at the school. And "Dr Walker had previously taught at Gresham's school," is helpful information about his background which I didn't previously know. (Okay, I'm going to check his Who's Who entry to see how much that confirms.) "Wivenhoe is a sleepy village on the outskirts of Colchester, connected by a seasonal ferry service across the Colne river to Fingringhoe [ . . . ] and Rowhedge," is, while admittedly a bit of a digression from the subject matter, a picturesque and informative snippet of information about the geography of the north of Essex. I think those fragments alone are enough to show that this is no mindless act of vandalism. They are all meaningful, and worthy of being welcomed into our corpus of knowledge with open arms! :) It's true that the author went overboard with his attempts at humour, but it seemed to me that it was a light-hearted and affectionate tribute, not a vicious personal attack. What about, "his reputation as a "Manager more than a Teacher" was proved to be unfounded and he became well-liked for his "firm but usually fair" style and his interesting educational delivery techniqes"? Well-liked! And interesting! Those are not the words of a boy with a personal vendetta against his headmaster. Yes, it poked fun in parts, but the man does have a sense of humour. I expect he would have found it at least vaguely amusing, if he'd read it. But am I going on about this too much? I think I am. I'll shut up now. Okay, back to work, then... :) -- Oliver P. 20:00, 22 Aug 2003 (UTC)

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In your contribution to Dorothy L. Sayers on 2002-04-27 you added (if I'm reading the archives right) a comment on Sayers and the Inklings. I didn't know she had ever associated with them formally, though the assessment of the members' attitudes surely rings true. When was this? Could you give me the source?
thanks, Dandrake 02:24, 7 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Hi,
Thanks for the quick response. Hadn't thought of the Lewis biography. I'll take a look at that tonight. Dandrake 23:28, 7 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Dragged out the old A N Wilson last night and did a thorough check of Inklings, Sayers, and Gardner. No results either way. But I now have a report that Humphrey Carpenter says she never met with them; so I'm going to change the text. Dandrake 23:42, 8 Oct 2003 (UTC)

Hi Deb. I just had a good laugh -- I see you created the entries for Ross and Norris McWhirter last March. I was just reading them now and noticed that Ross' birthdate was 8th December 1925, while Norris' was 12th August 1925 -- I thought their poor mum must have had the longest pregnancy on record! :) Someone corrected Norris' entry to August a few months ago, and I've taken the liberty of doing the same to Ross as the only other online page I've found with Google gives an August birthdate. Arwel 00:50, 12 Oct 2003 (UTC)

How would you feel about me moving the Michael Howard disambiguation page to Michael Howard (disambiguation) then moving Michael Howard (politician) to Michael Howard and adding a note at the top that a disambiguation page also exists? Evercat 21:42, 3 Nov 2003 (UTC)

Anna Leonowens

Psst... Just in case you hadn't noticed (although I expect you probably have), Anna and the King: the Real Story of Anna Leonowens is on at 12:20 today on BBC2. (I hope I manage to get up in time to watch it!) -- Oliver P. 05:06, 2 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Thank you for letting me know about the Anna Leonowens programme. Unfortunately, I was in work at the time - but I could have recorded it if I'd read my Radio Times properly. Was it any good? Deb 20:31, 2 Jan 2004 (UTC)

I found it quite interesting, yes. I've written some stuff about it in an e-mail to you, because I ended up waffling for too long, and I don't want to clutter up your talk page too much! Having said that, I didn't say much of interest, so you can quite safely ignore the e-mail if you want... -- Oliver P. 05:44, 4 Jan 2004 (UTC)

The Peerage

Ms. Fisher,

As you have previously contributed to Wikipedia:WikiProject_Peerage, I thought that you might be interested in the subject of articles on peers. At present, there is a vote going on at Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_Peerage on the entitling of biographical articles on peers. If you please, you may there cast a vote. -- Lord Emsworth 20:24, Jan 10, 2004 (UTC)

On the aforementioned vote, you voted "No" on the first poll, saying: "I agree there is no need for deviation from the "most common name" rule. I favour the inclusion of titles only where the person is known specifically for holding that title and is referred to by that name." This comment specifically contradicts the option you have voted for, which requires, "No, the peerage title should not be included (in the article's title), except when necessary to disambiguate between two peers of the same name." I think that more in line with the sentiments you have heretofore expressed would be, to vote "Yes" on the first poll (the peerage title should be included (in the article's title), either in all cases, or when certain criteria are fulfilled), and "Yes" on the second one (there should be exceptions, based on criteria such as the rarity of the use of the peerage title). Therefore, I humbly apply to you to change your votes. Incidentally, I also beg to ask you if there is any hope or likelihood of me convincing you through an argument of the merits of my position. -- Lord Emsworth 13:26, Jan 11, 2004 (UTC)

Ms Fisher, it is indeed quite a shame that the wording of the questions was rather awkward. The original aim was for the first poll to decide whether peerage titles should be used at all, as some individuals felt that they were "antiquated appendages", and that peers should not receive "special" exceptions - exceptions from what, I still cannot determine. I had originally submitted the questions as a mere proposal. However, as some users were rather eager to begin the process of voting, the proposal was quickly accepted without any debate whatsoever. As I was asleep here in these United States, individuals from all manner of places where the light still shone chose to cast their votes, and left me helpless, as I could not very well cancel their votes and change the wording. Furthermore, people started voting on the second poll, which was not the original intention. Originally, the plan was for the second poll to be considered if and only if the "yes" proposition succeeded on the first one. The said option, as I have noted, leaves open whether peerage titles should be used in all cases or when only certain criteria are fulfilled, such as the commonness of the title. However, the eager voters chose to vote on both polls, an action that I could not undo. Nonetheless, Ms Fisher, you have my apologia for having caused such a misunderstanding for you and for other voters. But you have yet to answer my question as to whether there is any chance that your position on the second poll will be in any way swayed. Lord Emsworth

Hi Deb, I did some work on Alec Douglas-Home and something struck me. He was in as a Scottish politician. I changed that to British. Given the complexity in the UK now with different levels of politician and different political elites in each home rule state and UK-wide, it might make more sense to distinguish them by different terms. That Scottish be used exclusively for those active exclusively in the Scottish parliament or local government, ditto with Welsh and Northern Irish, and that those not active at home rule level but whose career was Westminster-based being described as British. As Home was exclusively Westminster based (even though there was no Scottish parliament in his day, British seems a lot more sensible than Scottish. Any thoughts? FearÉIREANN 20:09, 11 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Hi Deb - thanks for editing my article on Captain John Porteous. I'm new to Wikipedia, so am just getting used to the stylistic conventions - and having my finely crafted work altered! :-)

Please let me know if I'm inadvertently making any serious errors - I'm anxious to be accountable! Agendum 01:17, 14 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Thanks for fixing my English

Greets Deb,

Thanks for fixing my crappy English. The articles became much better that way. :-) --grin

Goodness Gracious Me

"The title is taken from a hit song of the 1960s in which Peter Sellers impersonated an Indian doctor and Sophia Loren his patient."

I'd seen this but I was thinking perhaps people were over-analysing the title. I thought this was a stereotyped Indian phrase that had been around for ages - almost every person imitating an Indian uses that phrase! Surely that predated Peter Sellars?

Zuytdorp Survivor 23:07, 28 Jan 2004 (UTC)~

Re: GGM theme tune I'm not accustommed to Wikipedia chats - is each half of a conversation normally on a different talk page? Anyway I'm pretty sure the old song "Goodness Gracious Me" is unrelated, at least musically, to the GGM theme tune. I'll take a listen to the old song and compare.

Zuytdorp Survivor 00:19, 2 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Ahh, I see your entry on Talk:Goodness Gracious Me. Seems a much better place.

Zuytdorp Survivor 00:22, 2 Feb 2004 (UTC)

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I'm afraid you have a case of mistaken identity. I am quite single.David Newton 02:27, 19 Feb 2004 (UTC)

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Hi Deb

I was creating articles on both Sanday and Scalpay in the Inner Hebrides and confused the titles of them. Hopefully its all sorted now. Thanks for drawing my attention to it. Warofdreams 18:50, 19 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Welsh hat

Funny thing was, I originally clicked through the link expecting to find a learned discourse about smut control on passenger liners... It's a pity all the pictures of them are copyright, because they are rather atmospheric - redolent of 1950s Britain. I have a cousin who served as a purser on the Orient Line and I remember going round one of his ships with him at Tilbury and asking what the Welsh Hat was. seglea 23:33, 19 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Shetland archaeology

I'll see what I can do. I've never actually been to Shetland myself, though I had a fantastic trip to Orkney, which inspired me to write all these Scottish island pages. I think we should at least have pages on Mousa broch and Jarlshof, but pretty well every island seems to have a chambered cairn or ruined broch, with Clickimin broch gaining particular plaudits. Warofdreams 17:23, 22 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Charles Caroll

Deb,

You moved his page from ...,Barrister to ... (barrister). Before I move it back I wanted to ask if you had a particyular reason, other that the normal Wiki convention. I piut where I did since he actually signed his name that way and was generally known by that name. It seems to me to be part of his name, and he disambiguated himself during his own life that way. So,, we have the article for 'Charles Carroll of Carrollton' and 'Charles Carroll, Barrister'. This is just a courtesy note, I'll move it back next week unless you strongly object. Thanks, and keep up the good work at Wiki.... Lou I 19:27, 10 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Paula Yates

Hi Deb, as the original author of Paula Yates, perhaps you will be familiar enough with the subject matter to integrate the disjointed paragraph at the bottom of the article (apparently written by Hughie Green's son Christopher) into the main body of the article. Cheers, Cyan 23:10, 11 Mar 2004 (UTC)

My Name

Hi Deb. It certainly would be a bit rude to ask me that. I'll just leave it to your imagination!  ;o) Big Jim Fae Scotland

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Guest family

Deb, Great work on the Guest family. Do you know who founded the guest hospital in Dudley? I would like to tie a bow round that but haven't managed to find the answer. Cutler 13:53, 20 Mar 2004 (UTC)

IRISH GREATS

Hi...If you like...I can add a few hundred more Irish born 'Summa cum Laude' and alumni. ps...regarding Irish Americans. As a son of Hibernia....I most assuredly would include them. It would take a few pages to list though videlicet,every great Holly wood star you care to mention. Spencer Tracy; Tyrone Power; Jimmy Cagny; etc etc...right up to Dennis Quaid; Meg Ryan;Tom Cruise;Harrison Ford; and a thousand more.'major names'..... BTW..John Travolta's mother was Irish. Like Quaid, he is an aviation pilot too. ps...I have not been a 'hollywood' film fan since 1970's. Speaking of aviation and science...a good percantile of 1st/2nd/3rd generation Irish folk are in NASA and MIT,Harvard; Yale; Columbia; Penn; Stanford; etc are from the 'ol' country. Similarly in medicine; law ;artds and humanities; business and of course politics. Feel free to enquire...at samuelbeckett@eircom.net

good work

hey, I just think thr articles you write are interesting and informative. Good job. Ensiform 23:42, 3 Apr 2004 (UTC)

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Robert Goddard

Deb,

I see that you created both the pages for Robert Goddard (scientist) and for Robert Goddard (novelist), along with the disambiguation page, Robert Goddard. I think that we should move the page on the scientist to "Robert Goddard" with just a link to the page on the novelist on it. I think this will make things easier for people for the following reasons:

1. the rocket scientist is far, far better known than the novelist, as a google search clearly demonstrates;
2. the page on the scientist has been edited 15 times (four times by myself) while the page on the novelist has only been edited twice (once by you and once by someone putting a stub tag on it);
3. the page on the scientist is linked to from 39 other pages while the page on the novelist is linked to from only two pages, Robert Goddard and List of people by name: Go-Gq; and
4. the "Robert Goddard" page is dedicated to the rocket scientist in both the French and German editions of Wikipedia.

I wanted to get input before just going ahead with the change and since you've been involved with both pages I though I'd run it by you. Do you think this would be a good idea? Please visit the Talk:Robert Goddard page to leave feedback.

Jacob1207 18:38, 4 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother

Please see Wikipedia:How to move a page. Copy and paste moves are illegal.

Let me known if the new disambiguation page I made is correctly titles. T in "the" supposed to be capitalized?--Jiang 22:54, 10 Apr 2004 (UTC)

According to Wikipedia:Disambiguation, it's fine to have a short da listing at the top. --Jiang 00:12, 12 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Standards of debate

I am always happy to have a good argument on any topic. But after some experience here I have made it a practice not to bother with people who make stupid ad hominem remarks such as the one you made at the royal titles page. Adam 05:23, 11 Apr 2004 (UTC)

No doubt that's why you replied, Adam. Nice to see you maintaining your accustomed standard of debate. Deb 16:48, 11 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Gilbertine

Thanks for the edits and linkage on the Gilbertine article. I was in sort of a mad flurry yesterday, editing and creating new entries, and was a bit hasty in places.

Hal - Henry V

Hi Deb - just thought I would draw your attention to a question about one of your edits on the Talk:Henry V of England page! --Chuq 02:18, 22 Apr 2004 (UTC)

The Desert Song

Thanks for adding the plot synopsis and trimming the lyrics. I've never seen/heard the darn thing, is it actually any good? Dpbsmith 18:47, 28 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Eliza Doolittle

Hello. I'm new to all this, and it's great to see an article I stubbed grow. Just wondered about your addition here: 'Her unprecedented use of the word "bloody" caused a sensation.' I feel this gives the impression that the actresss said the word spontaneously. Is that the case? Or is it, as I assumed, in the script? If it's the latter, I feel it is misleading as it stands. (Though, I don't feel massively strongly about it). --bodnotbod 20:06, Apr 29, 2004 (UTC)

• "Actually," I thought, "why don't I stop being so lazy and look it up?" It is in the script. I'll change the passage, and you can rejig it if you don't like my style, eh?

Roguish Ian McShane

Thanks for picking up on my poor little stub and doubling its size. I've been doing quite a bit of "minor british celeb" article writing recently and that one I didn't quite put the effort in that I should've done. Pete/Pcb21 (talk) 17:07, 6 May 2004 (UTC)

I replied to you on my talk page. Pete/Pcb21 (talk) 19:45, 6 May 2004 (UTC)

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I saw on the Silures that you have written: "...South Walean roots...". I am probably being ignorant, but isn't the correct adjective 'Welsh'?? 17:51, 9 May 2004

Interesting point - for some reason we don't say, "South Welsh", or at least I've never heard anyone say it. Deb 19:06, 9 May 2004 (UTC)

Joan of Kent

Hi Deb - just wanted to let you know that there is a question on the Reference Desk about where the information about the date of birth of Joan of Kent came from - since it looks like you added that, I wondered whether you could throw some light on this. Much appreciated, Mark Richards 16:42, 11 May 2004 (UTC)

Thanks Deb! Mark Richards 05:20, 13 May 2004 (UTC)

Richard III

Hi Deb When I read my sources it seemed that there was no record of the June 13 beheading (except Morton of course), I'll check it & post refs. The propaganda on behalf of both camps may be worth a seperate section or article.

BTW the Richard III talk pages seem remarkably empty for such a controversial figure. Are they somewhere else that I've missed? --garryq 14:32, 17 May 2004 (UTC)

Hi No surprise that there's controversy over Richard, but I'll have to find the sources for the June 18 claim which I've heard before, but things are looking bleak for my editing. The Richard III Society website (which was offline when I reverted) says "but on 13 June Richard announced that a plot against him had been discovered and accused Lord Hastings of being the instigator. The latter was immediately executed and Archbishop John Rotherham, Bishop John Morton and Thomas, Lord Stanley were arrested." Whereas John Morton in wikipedia "Morton wrote in his History that at the lords' council meeting in the Tower of London on 13 June 1483, Richard suddenly called his men at arms into the room and had them arrest Hastings for treason and take him outside and chop his head off on a log they found handy. The story is not true -- the records show Hastings was arrested then, but he was formally charged with treason, tried for it, convicted and sentenced, and executed on 18 June in the usual way the law prescribed." To end on a positive note for Richard: the image on wikipedia was retouched by the Tudors to give him a humped-back. Not a new story, but nice to see it in "The Queen's Website" [2] (http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/page1822.asp) (Monarch of the Month on the Kids Zone) and [3] (http://www.royal.gov.uk/output/page50.asp) "It is an example of the Tudors' dynastic propaganda, and part of the legend which was the basis of Shakespeare's plays". If you think it needs NPOV please change, but I think we need to mention both claims until one or other is confirmed. ----garryq 00:01, 18 May 2004 (UTC)

Mintleaf

That would be funny wouldn't it. Perhaps mintleaf is someone who, like me used to use Mint or Minty as an alias, but found that there are far too many other people there using Mint and didn't want to be Mint9848x or something so came up with something similar. Sorry Mintleaf is no relation. Mintguy (T) 17:07, 17 May 2004 (UTC)

Minty is short for Aramynta, which I took from Moondial (although in the book it was spelt Araminta)). Aramynta was the name of my main character when I played an online D&D type game many many years ago. Mintguy (T) 17:17, 17 May 2004 (UTC)

Eleanor Talbot

We do generally include courtesy titles, though (like Lady Jane Grey). And she was a daughter of the Earl of Shrewsbury and Waterford. Proteus (Talk) 20:53, 19 May 2004 (UTC)

Cymraeg

Deb on air.

Dinah

Thank you for correcting my gender pronoun confusion at Dinah! ^_^ - Gilgamesh 11:21, 8 June 2004 (UTC)

Another World

I noticed you're a fan of Corrie; so am I! I wrote a little bit of a bio on Amanda Barrie; if you're not too busy, take a look at it. Since I'm in America, we stopped getting Corrie when the CBC went digital four years ago. I also see you did some edits on my Another World profiles. Were you a fan of AW? I know it was shown in Britain for a little while in the early nineties. I believe it was SkySoap. TheCustomOfLife 01:33, 9 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Oh, Another World was such a good show. Before Felicia and the gang arrived in the 1980s, AW was very earthy. The show was still great after they arrived, but suddenly glam was in. I guess because of Dallas and such, you know. Corrie never strayed (much) from those roots. That's why I liked that show. But AW had the most flawlessly-written and acted cast out of any American soap. So, it was depressing that it didn't get more viewers, and then the plot was hacked up toward the end. TheCustomOfLife 16:47, 9 Jun 2004 (UTC)