Talk:Christmas tree

Another common Christmas decoration is a "Christmas ball", a reflecting sphere of thin metal-coated glass, working as a reducing wide-angle mirror. I deleted this because it's not about Christmas trees. Perhaps for a more general entry on Christmas decorations or festive decor? Wetman 00:04, 24 Feb 2004 (UTC)

According to one legend, Saint Boniface attempted to introduce the idea of trinity to the pagan tribes using the Cone-shaped evergreen trees because of their triangular appearance. This isn't a genuine legend in the vita of Boniface, though efforts must have been made to "christianize" the symbolic fir and pine somehow. The "Trinity triangle" doesn't sound very likely, does it. I left it in the entry while we try to focus this statement. Wetman 00:11, 24 Feb 2004 (UTC)

Contents

1 How real is the supposed pagan origin? 2 Viking 3 Query 4 Trafalgar Square Tree 5 Secular symbol? 6 Academic definition

How real is the supposed pagan origin?

According to the German Wikipedia entry, the first Christmas tree was erected in 1605 in Strasbourg (now France, but the city's culture was mostly southern German back then) and this was many centuries after paganism ended in Europe, and even Martin Luther was already dead for decades by then. How much of the info on pagan origins in this article is well-founded, and how much is just speculation? 82.83.135.95 17:45, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Well, the pagan ways did not disappear at once with the arrival of Christianity. Nobody knows when Jesus was born. It was a conscious lie from the church's side that he was born on the midwinter solstice in order to make a pagan festivity Christian. Moreover, it is a fact that evergreens were used to decorate homes in the Germanic countries since pagan times. If the first Christmas tree was erected in Strasbourg it only means that the Strasburgers already had the concept, but that no documentation of a previous Christmas tree has survived.

Is the connection possible? - Yes. Is the connection possible to prove? -No. The important question is whether the pagan tradition is relevant. I think it is.--Wiglaf 17:58, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

it is probably true that there is a pagan connection. It is, however, indirect. Unlike Carnival the tradition did not survive in remote or rural areas, as you would expect from a genuinely pagan tradition, but it became current in urban, burgeois circles in the late 16th century. I think the history section is fair, except for :

The tradition of hanging decorations (representing fruit or gifts) on the trees is very old, with some early reports coming from the Alsace-Lorraine upper Rhine region

because the first report is from Bremen, 1570, and very old is suggestive of much greater age. dab (ᛏ) 13:47, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)

I hope I have not been all to bold. Please do review my edit. Here is my source: [1] (http://www.nzz.ch/2004/12/23/vm/page-articleA2G1M.html) (German language NZZ, the article will only be online for one month, and then until the google cache expires). dab (ᛏ) 19:37, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)

No, I think you have improved the page.--Wiglaf 22:18, 24 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Viking

This text about the sacrifice can only origin from Adam of Bremen? Adam does certainly not use the term viking when he speaks about the sacrifies in Uppsala, but in his books he speaks exactly about vikings in south sweden, and he says they vikings were pirats, nothing else. This is an error, in my opinion. Dan Koehl 12:28, 3 Dec 2004 (UTC)

After almost one month, theres no source for the mentioned viking kings in the article, so I remove the term, of above reasons. Dan Koehl 05:38, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Query

Posted by the photo by User:Rebroad: (What is the relevance of it being in Germany?)
Reply: see the first sentence at Christmas tree#Natural trees about differing preferences between Europe and North America (and also that it has candles, not electric lights; candles are still widely used in Europe) - MPF 22:47, 28 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Trafalgar Square Tree

http://www.norway.org.uk/culture/christmastree.htm says that the gift is from the City of Oslo not Bergen. IVoteTurkey 10:53, 13 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Yeah it's definitely Oslo on http://www.london.gov.uk/mayor/trafalgar_square/xmas.jsp it says the Mayor of Oslo attends the ceremony. I'll change the article. IVoteTurkey

Ignore that - the article was referring to the tree in Newcastle not London. IVoteTurkey

Secular symbol?

There has been a lot of controversy lately - you see some every year - over people putting up Christmas decorations and trees in public places, like libraries. Someone will come in and complain at the lack of Menorah or other holiday symbols, as to equally represent all religions (or at least all major religions, since it would be extremely difficult to represent every religion). The person responsible will argue back that a Christmas tree is a secular symbol, devoid of religious significance, and is a symbol of "the holidays." I personally believe that a Christmas tree is a religious symbol, but others argue that it's not necessary to have a tree to celebrate Christmas and it has no relation to the birth of Christ (not like a Menorah's significance and relation to the cleansing of the temple). I think this argument should be covered somewhere in the article. LockeShocke 00:16, Dec 25, 2004 (UTC)

Academic definition

For students, to Christmas tree a test (specifically a computer-graded multiple choice test) is to fill in the answer sheet randomly, or in such a way as to form a design. Reasons for Christmas treeing a test include boredom, rebellion, and desperation (for students who are not prepared for the test). The name (an example of "verbing") comes from one popular pattern, which resembles a Christmas tree.

I have never seen this usage of the term (is it an obscure regional use?). Can anyone supply a source? jdb ❋ (talk) 23:52, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)