Talk:All Blacks

The New Zealand Rugby Football Union (NZRFU) failed to learn their lesson from the debacle of 1976 (where African nations boycotted the Montreal Olympics) and 1981 (the disastrous south African 'Springbok' Rugby tour of New Zealand, which deeply divided the nation to the point of unprecedented civil unrest) and proceeded to announce an All Black tour of South Africa in 1985 during South Africa's state of emergency. Thankfully the NZRFU were challenged in the high court by two lawyers who argued it was not in the NZRFU's charter to tour South Africa in such times of turmoil, they achieved an injunction and the tour was called off. The majority of New Zealanders thru ignorance and/or a sheer love of rugby (in particularly playing against their greatest rivals, the Springboks) supported all tours to and from South Africa during the aparthied regime...as an 11 year old in 1981 I supported the tour by the Springboks purely as a chance to play South Africa but as a far more worldly and enlightened 35 year old in 2005 all I can say is I want to stand up and applaud the anti-tour/anti-aparthied protesters who put their lives in danger by making a stand against racism and oppression. You are the true heroes. Blair Kavanagh, Sydney Australia.

Contents

1 Controversial tours 2 General/detailed team history 3 Naming of this article 4 Pregame Ritual 5 Jersey 6 Culture

Controversial tours

Can someone with more knowledge than I put in a discussion about how the All Blacks' tour of South Africa caused a black African boycott of the Olympics? -- Zoe

The 1986(?) Edinburgh Commonwealth Games suffered an African boycott; is that the occasion Zoe is thinking about? Robin Patterson 00:40, 16 Aug 2004 (UTC)

1976 Olympics suffered an African Boycott in protest of the All Black tour to South Africa of that year. After a lot of hot air, most African teams would have called off the Boycott at the last moment had the then Chairman of the New Zealand Olympic and Commonwealth Games Association, Sir Lance Cross, expressed some sort of regret/disaproval of the tour on behalf of the NZOCGA. He didn't. There was talk of kicking NZ out of the games, but instead the African teams (most of whom had actually arrived in Montreal) boycotted. Hence the much awaited 1500m clash between John Walker and Filbert Bayi of Tanzania never happened. Read Cry of Treason by Tom Newnham for the full story.--Bungle 04:20, 25 Feb 2005 (UTC)

• I have added my impressions of the times (1960's-1980s) that preceded the boycott. Someone else may be able to provide a better resource than my own eyewitness memory. Perhaps we need a separate article on the 1981 Springbok tour too? - kiwiinapanic
  • We HAVE a page called "1981 Springbok Tour", but it redirects to this article. Such a seminal event in Southern Hemisphere history needs its own page. As one who sat on a motorway, I may be considered to be too biased an "observer". Robin Patterson 00:40, 16 Aug 2004 (UTC)
    • My girlfriend keeps threatening to write an article about the 1981 Springbok tour (although she'd be no less biased than you, Robin!) - I'll tell her that there are voices clamouring for it! —Stormie 00:52, Aug 16, 2004 (UTC)

p.s. isn't "While the 1985 Springbok tour saw major rugby fields ringed in barbed wire for Springbok games, there were no protests as political circumstances had changed" just flat-out wrong? I thought the tour was cancelled after a legal challenge. Also, I think "Also many African Countries boycotted the 1984 Olympics" is wrong too - I think only the Soviet bloc boycotted that year. —Stormie 12:05, Aug 16, 2004 (UTC)

I have started to collect some notes, details and links, which can be found at User:Stormie/1981 Springbok tour of New Zealand, if anyone would like to join in. I haven't attempted to mold these into a coherent article yet, though. —Stormie 03:59, Aug 18, 2004 (UTC)

I find the Springbok Tours section totally incomprehensible. I don't know the history at all, so as an ignorant reader, I am completely lost. For instance,

Playing the Springboks of South Africa has become a traditional rugby competition. In the 1950s and 1960s, the South African apartheid policies had an impact on touring team selection, with Maori players not being selected for some South African tours. By the 1970s public protests and political pressure forced the New Zealand Rugby Union to either field a non-racial team or not tour. However the Springboks continued to be racially selected. As a result, the Norman Kirk Labour Government prevented the Springboks from touring during the mid 1970s. The Rugby Union protested that politics and sport should not be mixed up.

Firstly, this has way too much passive voice. "Maori players not being selected"... by whom? Then there are phrases like "...forced the New Zealand Rugby Union to either field a non-racial team or not tour"... Huh??? Even overlooking the split infinitive here, I think you need to be a rugby afficionado to really understand this whole section. I'd fix it myself if I had any idea what it all means. --P3d0 15:03, Sep 19, 2004 (UTC)

I've uplifted the Springbok stuff from the article and moved it to 1981 Springbok Tour, as (although incomplete) it really doesn't belong here. porge 08:09, Sep 30, 2004 (UTC)

General/detailed team history

Long term should there be a history of the All Blacks here? Records of tours and each match, bios of each player and their record? Thoughts? -- SimonLyall

There definitely should be a history section. Records of games should probably go else where e.g. Tri Nations or be listed on a sub page so as to leave the main article uncluttered. Maybe a brief summary of each years tours can be made. Seeing as there are over one thousand All Blacks, player biographies should really be separate articles. Although brief mention of noteable players can be made. -- Popsracer 05:19, 30 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Anyone keen to start the [oval] ball rolling - maybe check whether other national teams have been written up, so as to get an idea of workable styles. Maybe NOT mention Tri Nations THIS month! Robin Patterson 00:40, 16 Aug 2004 (UTC)

..and don't look to Australia national rugby union team as an example of what an article should be - it's two sentences, a bunch of red links to famous players, and a "see also" section! —Stormie 00:52, Aug 16, 2004 (UTC)

Naming of this article

Why was this article renamed from All Blacks to New Zealand national rugby union team? The current naming convention says "Use the most common name of a person or thing that does not conflict..." and to me All Blacks is the most common name. So unless someone has strong objections I'll move it back to All Blacks. Although I see some merit in keeping New Zealand national rugby union team as a redirect. -- Popsracer 05:19, 30 Jul 2004 (UTC)

• I agree with the proposed move+redirect. ("National rugby" ... "Is that the NRL? Or the Sevens?") ("Rugby union" ... "Hey, we never call it that in this country!") - Robin Patterson 00:24, 16 Aug 2004 (UTC)
• I guess the renaming happened to make all the national Rugby teams consistently named - the argument in favour would be that it makes life easier for article-writers (e.g. imagine working on a World Cup article if all the national teams had different naming styles), but a redirect would handle that just as well, so I'm inclined to agree with the "Use the most common name.." school of thought and go for All Blacks. —Stormie 00:52, Aug 16, 2004 (UTC)
• Seeing as there has been general support for the move back to All Blacks and no objections, I have made the move. -- Popsracer 01:51, 16 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Pregame Ritual

There should be mention to the pregame ritual the All Blacks take part in before each game.

• There is - it is called the haka. MyNameIsNotBob 06:54, May 23, 2005 (UTC)

• Though the haka should really be called a prayer not a war dance.

Jersey

is that the best picture of the jersey we can find? it doesnt even have the silver fern on it.

Culture

All Black cultural impact is huge on New Zealand, in season, the All Blacks are on the news almost everyday and the country goes on a deppression when they lose, so i ask for someone to research this and add a section.Mexaguil 06:53, 13 May 2005 (UTC)