Talk:Palestinian views of the peace process/archive 3

Mediation

The article is currently not being mediated. Bensaccount 22:23, 27 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I have made a formal request for mediation on this article to the Wiki-En list, and have asked LittleDan and Ed Poor to mediate. RK 21:41, Jan 28, 2004 (UTC)

Ok, I'll be a mediator if you want. I'm not sure I can do that good a job, as this is obviously my first time as a mediator :). I'm not really sure how much I can do as a mediator, but if it's within my power, I'd like to stop RK or anyone else from telling people not to talk, whatever the reason. Even if a Nazi comes here, they can still debate on this issue (I'm saying this as a Jew myself (but that shouldn't make me biased, I hope. I still haven't formed opinions on this issue yet)). LDan

Actually, after reading a bunch of comments and versions of the article, I think it should be merged into a larger article about the Israeli-Palestinian peace process as a whole. I don't think I can serve as an unbiased mediator, if nonbias is required. If the purpose is to just organize calmer discussions, which I'm not sure it is, then I might still be able to be a mediator. LDan

Dan, I really think it does not matter whether you have an opinion on the matter yourself, as long as you 1) do not have a strong opinion on the matter to the point of finding yourself supporting one of the two disputants pov and 2) do not feel in a very negative way about one of the disputant, to the point you won't behave with honesty toward his pov. Apparently, this is not the case either for the article, nor for Martin or Robert; so I am sure you can help :-) Anthere

My goals for mediation are not specifically related to this article. I don't feel that no bias is essential (or else RK and myself would likely never agree on a mediator), but I feel that we need someone who has no strong opinions on the underlying issues - someone who doesn't care, basically, or at least is willing to completely cover up their opinions for the duration. Martin 22:19, 29 Jan 2004 (UTC)

I am really conflicted (and therefore I don't have strong opinions) on the Israel issue, is that what you mean? I'm willing to do hide my views on this specific article, but that doesn't seem to matter. What are your goals for mediation anyway? It seems that RK wants to get rid of alleged Nazis in Wikipedia and allow Wikipedia to expose Palestinians as the terrorists they are (in his opinion); what point are you trying to make, Martin? LDan 03:45, 31 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Dan, please do not fall for the distortions that certain people are spreading about me. The position you mention above is not my position; if you wish to know what I believe just ask. Better yet, see the edits I made. My edits do not make any such claims; my repeated edits specifically stated that all Palestinians are not terrorists, and that all Palestinians do not want to destroy the State of Israel. Unlike Martin, I accept the fact that many groups of Palestinians exist, and each has their own beliefs and agenda. Unlike Martin, I allow Palestinians to speak for themselves, and believe that our articles should show the full range of views that exist within the Palestinian community. I find it curious that this is considered acceptable within the mainstream academic worls, within the Arab press and Arab commmunity, but only here on Wikipedia it is disallowed as "anti-Palestinian." RK 15:25, Jan 31, 2004 (UTC)

These characterisation of my beliefs are incorrect. Martin 17:43, 31 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Robert is right Dan. If you wish to know what he believes, ask him. Similarly, if you wish to know what he thinks of Martin position and behavior, ask him. Then, do the same with Martin :-) Anthere

I'm sorry I misunderstood. I was actually guessing that view from your mailing list posts, not others' distoritions, but I guess I just misinterpreted you. LDan 16:55, 31 Jan 2004 (UTC)

On the separate issue you mentioned, I do believe that it is inappropriate to allow "Christian Identity adherents and/or Nazis to spread anti-Semitism, racism, homophobia, bigotry and Holocaust denial on Wikipedia. They may be free to come and falsify history, but the rest of us are free to disagree with them, and we are encouarged to explain how and why their views are rejected in the mainstream. I don't see how this is a problem. Until recently, this was the consensus of almost all Wikipedia contributors. RK

Are they allowed to present their views in an NPOV fashion? I take back what I said before about not calling people Nazis if you wish to do so just for discussion. LDan 16:55, 31 Jan 2004 (UTC)

I will state my goals for mediation in private, once myself and RK have agreed on a mutually acceptable mediator. From what you say, LittleDan, I would have no problems with you mediating, as I do not believe that "nonbias" on this specific article is required. However, if you wish to recuse yourself, I would not want you to mediate if you do not feel you are capable of the task. I would also, as I mentioned before, be happy for TUF-KAT to mediate. Martin 13:49, 31 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Why keep your goals secret? Wikipedia is a public project. The fact that you have secret goals scares me. RK 15:25, Jan 31, 2004 (UTC)

Martin. I think everyone is aware now that you would accept TufKat as a mediator; but obviously it is not the case of RK; I also think Tuf himself do not feel very confortable with the idea. So, it is probably best not to talk about that option any more. Anthere

It's not that kind of secret goal, it's just that he doesn't want to be accused of being a Nazi. Whether this is true or not I will not say, because one of you wouldl get mad at me. Since RK invited me to be a mediator (and I don't think he's withdrawn that), Martin accepted, and Ed hasn't responded, I guess would be a reasonable candidate for mediator. Would you have any objections to TUF-KAT being the mediator instead? He was much more involved in the process of setting up mediation than I was.

If either of you want to send me something privately (if you choose me over TUF-KAT for mediation), just email me at LittleDanEhren @ yahoo . com, with the spaces removed. LDan 16:55, 31 Jan 2004 (UTC)

Robert, the point is not for Martin to keep the goals secrets, but rather to discuss them privately. It is perhaps best that Martin explains his position to Dan, and that you explain your position to Dan, and that Dan check whether he has understood both of your positions. Do you agree with talking privately to Dan only, or do you prefer the process to be open ? We wish, for many reasons that I can explain to you if you wish, that mediation process is kept private. What is your opinion ? Anthere

My goals for mediation are not secret, and I have made them public in the past, but I do not believe that stating them publically at this point in time would be in the best interests of Wikipedia and the mediation process. Martin 17:43, 31 Jan 2004 (UTC)