Talk:Empress Myeongseong of Korea
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An event mentioned in this article is an October 8 selected anniversary.
I've listed this article on Wikipedia:Cleanup. There are several things that should be fixed:
- There is a clear anti-Japanese bias in the article. It needs to be written from a neutral point of view.
- The title of the article doesn't have any apparent relation to the person the article is about. If Queen Min and Empress Myeoung-Song are two names for the same person, this should be made clear in the article (and perhaps there should be a redirect).
- There seem to be some missing facts. e.g. The article says Queen Min "did many things to save" her country... but only one thing is specifically mentioned. A more inclusive list would be better.
- -- Ortonmc 04:36, 10 Jan 2004 (UTC)
There is a clear anti-Japanese bias in the article.
Please identify what anti-Japanese bias is present, so it can be neutralised. -- Caffelice 17:19, 14 Aug 2004 (UTC)
A picture would be nice.
Also, I don't quite follow what you mean by anti-Japanese bias. The Japanese really did have her assasinated since she attempted to normalize and strengthen ties with Russia, western nations.
The 'samurai' who are said to have assassinated Queen Min were as a class abolished by Imperial Decree well before 1895. How was it 'brilliance' in foreign affairs for her to court Russia and China, two other foreign powers with their own designs on Korea? I also find it doubtful that the Meiji Emperor of Japan personally 'viewed her as an obstacle'. This does not fit with what we generally know about Meiji and his government: the tendency in Japan of leaders to 'reign not rule'. I would want to see some documentary evidence to support such a conclusion. The article is stylistically awkward. I would not say that the article shows an 'anti-Japanese bias' as much as a pro-Queen Min bias.
The samurai mentioned in the article are the ones who were specially hired to threaten the Korean court. Meiji was also directly involved in the empress's assassination since he was the one who also forced Emperor Gojong to abdicate later on. Historical records all back up the article's conclusions. You can't argue against it becuase it's based on solid proof, despite what Japanese nationalists claim.
My point was that no such thing as 'samurai' existed at the time in question. Perhaps you should say 'former samurai' if that is indeed what they were. Or, just say 'assassins' as the page says currently. I don't doubt that terrible things were done in the name of the Meiji Emperor (cf. 'at the command of'), but saying he was directly involved in these decisions or in giving these orders, saying he was the individual who 'forced' the later abdication, goes against the weight of established knowledge of not only Meiji but also the Japanese imperial system. See the Wikipedia article on Meiji or the works of Hane, Reischauer, and just about any other established name in modern Japanese history.
- Please produce some proof that Meiji Emperor considered her an obstacle before going on a "Nationalist! Nationalist!" routine. As you probably know, Japan had a constitution and a whole set of laws that determined what the emperor can do. All records from that time are stored and can be viewed at Japan's National Library. Give the exact date, the exact name of law or order, the exact chain of command from Meiji Emperor to those who actually committed, and any proof beside those by "nationalists" from Korea. Revth 04:06, 17 Nov 2004 (UTC)
It's exactly at times like these that I feel shame as a Japanese. Not only does Revth up there try to dispute the factual truth of this article, he tries to make it less critical of Japan. I've checked many Internet sources (all Korean, of course, since Japanese records cover up any relations between the Queen Min incident and the Japanese government), and although they do not give "give the exact date, the exact name of law or order, the exact chain of command from Meiji Emperor to those who actually committed," it's quite obvious, except for dumb Japanese historians, that the whole incident was schemed by Japan's imperial court and Japanese officials in Tokyo. While Meiji may have not been directly involved in the incident, it is evidently undisputable that he desired the icorporation of Korea as part of Japan. That's why he later requested to the Governer-general of Korea in 1910, after the annexation of Korea as part of Imperial Japan, to have all royal family members of the Joseon Dynasty be married into the Japanese imperial line (Note: this fact is clearly recorded, so do not dispute 'less you want be humiliated). He even made Sunjong, last emperor of Korea, marry a Japanese princess who was barren.
And by the way, it is impossible to "give the exact date, the exact name of law or order, the exact chain of command from Meiji Emperor to those who actually committed," because this incident was done in top secret. I'm sure that Japanese officials in charge of Japan's government at the time weren't stupid enough to leave evidence behind, eh?
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I find this sentence near the end of the article to be a bit odd: "She is the only empress enshrined in Jongmyo; all other females are queens." It is not incorrect, of course, but it is odd because it would seem (at least to me) to imply that there may have been other Korean empresses, but they weren't enshrined in Jongmyo. In fact, Empress Myeongseong was the only Korean empress in history, making the quoted sentence not only unnecessary but also possibly misleading.
Also, it is probably misleading to say that Empress Myeongseong was enshrined in Jongmyo, especially for Western readers who are not familiar with Jongmyo. Is it possible that some readers might understand "enshrined" to mean "buried"? After all, it is only her spirit (or ancestral) tablet (위패) that is enshrined in Jongmyo. As the article mentions, her body was burned and was never entombed. - Suho1004
--- No, I don't think there's any problem with the word "enshrined", as it does not equate "buried", and I think it's clear enough that she is not physically buried in Jongmyo.
However, the article mentions that the name Myeongseong means "bright and shiny star". Does it? The "Seong" here is not the same word as "star" to my knowledge, or is there some hidden etymology at play? Uly 19:18, 9 May 2005 (UTC)
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I just wonder about the obviously completely lacking security at the palace - weren't there any guards ? Is there more information to shed light on this ? Besides that i dont see anti-japanese bias in the article. The change to "empress of Korea" also makes IMHO sense.
Chris
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