Talk:Danzig law

Additional HRR (Helig Roem. Reich) or HRE Holy Roman Empire city seals see:[1] (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=sigillum+burgensium&btnG=Google+Search)

So what does this article say? What is Danzig Law? Does this article belong here? Can I get my money back?

S-O.C

per page history, the above inserted by User:Space Cadet, noted by Jerzy 20:11, 2003 Dec 18 (UTC)

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It sounds to me as if this Danzig Law approximates a city charter, at a time when monarchs generally did what they damn well pleased whenever they damn well pleased, and when major German cities had (presumably to encourage merchants to base themselves there in confidence that arbitrary changes in commercial conditions weren't going to be imposed by the monarch) complex legal statuses. I believe that an example is "magdeburgische Stadtrecht" (literally, Magdeburgian city right or city law), which (without ever pursuing the subject) i've always translated in my head as "the package of city rights that was first put together to apply to the city of Magdeburg". --Jerzy 20:11, 2003 Dec 18 (UTC)

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Recht as "Law", not "Rights"

I'm very pleased to have WolfgangPeters implicitly correct my bad translation at Talk:Danzig Law, which clearly over-exploited the etymological relationship between Recht and various "rights"! I begin to believe that the best all-around equivalent of Recht is not right but justice. (Though probably the best all-around word is seldom the best translation in a given context.)

I think part of the problem about the English word law is that it has many closely related but importantly different senses. (In fact, while often "justice" is used to mean "law", the reverse, "Law is another word for justice" would be a philosophical and controversial statement. I'm about to copy-edit Danzig Law, mostly to convert usage from what i think is too strongly influenced by German-language usage, to more of the usage of native speakers of English. I know that i risk making some mistakes, especially with this one word. So i think it will be important for someone with more sensitivity to the nuances of "Recht" to check how i have tried to fit "law" to express them.

My biggest concern is that one versatile word:

• (noun functioning as a noun)

"a law" means (outside the sciences)

a statute, what results from a single act of law-making by a legislature or someone, like a monarch, who may rule by decree.

"the law" means (unless the context indicates otherwise)

usually the whole body of laws that are in force, but sometimes the profession that includes both lawyers (also known as (AKA) attorneys in US, and barristers and solicitors in UK and probably in other British-Commonwealth countries; Rechtsangewalt or maybe it's Rechtsanwalt, in German) and judges.

law (with no article), as in "studying law", means (for more colloquial use)

"the law" as defined above

lawmaker (the construction is equivalent to "maker of laws" or "one who makes laws") is a colloquial term for

"legislator", especially (at least in the US) "a member of a legislature" (in contexts where it doesn't matter which house of the legislature they belong to).

• (attributive noun, i.e. noun functioning as an adjective)

law book usually means

a book containing both laws (statutes) and information useful, especially to lawyers, in understanding how to interpert those statutes, including legislative history, court decisions, and arguments based on the (supposed) underlying philosophy of the law as a whole or of a given area of the law.

(in contrast) a statute book (usually and more colloquially, "the statutes" or in some states "the General Statutes")

a book containing just the laws in force at one point in time

law suit

a proceeding in a court, started by someone who wants to benefit by having a law (other than a law for punishment of a crime) enforced.

"Law records" is unlikely to be used, but

it probably would be taken to mean the same as "legal records", meaning

records that would be important evidence in a law suit

it arguably could mean

the records maintained by a lawyer as an aid to making decisions in her professial role

it could logically (but probably not in practice) mean

records of the contents of laws, i.e., law books and/or statute books.

I'll be making my edit without being sure which sense of "law" User:WolfgangPeters had in mind (for lack of the cues most native speakers would have left), and hope for others including him, but especially those more fluently bilingual than he and i, to help out with further edits. [--Jerzy 21:50, 2004 Feb 6 (UTC)  : belated sig]

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A Removed Sentence

While i expect it to be a valuable part of the article, the sentence

The law were recorded in the Preussische Urkundenbuch, Regesten or law books of the Province of Prussia.

is mystifying at this point. It seems clear that this was before the 2nd partition, but was this before it had its own Willkuer? Did it change when Danzig's Hansa status did? Does it refer to the existence of the records being noted, or of their being reviewed, or does it mean Prussian had either a copy or the original in its archives? --Jerzy 21:50, 2004 Feb 6 (UTC)