Talk:Universalism

From Academic Kids

Interestingly, the Unification Church (UC) is both univeralist and unitarian, although should not be confused with Unitarian Universalism. For one thing, the UC is a highly detailed and specific theology, while UU has become largely creedless. I really got to write more about this. --Ed Poor 09:28 Aug 16, 2002 (PDT)

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"Universalism first became popular in the 19th century, leading to the formation in the United States of the Universalist Church of America, "

Is this factual, as a general statement? Universalism has always been "popular", however it is not always considered an orthodox belief. Gregory of Nyssa is commonly quoted as saying that, in his day, it is believed by almost everyone that there will be a Great Restoration that will put an end to all differences between people, and the whole creation will become the Church.

In fact, if popularity were the measure of Christian orthodoxy (but it isn't considered such by anyone, except perhaps universalists), I'm not sure that there has ever been a more orthodox view, since the popularity of this idea has never waned, much, even if it has sometimes been pushed out of view by dominant, non-universalist parties.

It hasn't always helped to reconcile differences between people while they wait for the happy day. Regrettably, there is an historical stream of anti-Jewish thinking that occasionally appears in universalism, blaming the Jews for infiltrating the surrounding nations with what is sometimes called "the Barbaric notions" of immutable prohibitions and everlasting punishments for transgressing them. However, it has served a formative role in the development of ecumenism, internationalism, women's rights, and the abolition of slavery.

It's true that in what had only recently become the United States, the Second Great Awakening included a big explosion of formally universalist teaching. But, people have always popularly liked the idea that there is a point, usually at the end of the world, sometimes as a cultural idea too, when differences won't matter anymore, because we'll all be Christians. As it has become more apparent that not everyone wants to be a Christian, popular universalism has transformed quite a bit.

These are just opinions on the level of hearsay. I don't think I'm qualified to edit the entry itself, since I am not a universalist, and don't have a sympathetic view of the issues involved in it, or its history. -- mkmcconn

Sounds to me like you know what you're talking about. I edited the popularity sentence based on what you said, or at least based on what I think you said. ;-) Wesley 18:58 Sep 19, 2002 (UTC)

Universal indoctrination

"allows or requires all people ... to join"

Can you give an example of a religion that "requires all people to join"? - UtherSRG 16:10, 17 Jun 2004 (UTC)

Buddhism, carried to its logical conclusion. Also capitalism and communism. --Eequor 01:36, 18 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Neither capitalism or communism are religions. They are societal, economic, governmental systems. Buddhism doesn't require all people to join, although it would, like many religions, expect its adherents to behave towards all people in an equal manner. This doesn't mean that all people who interact with Buddhists are Buddhists, only that Buddhists are to respect everyone's Buddha nature, regardless of whether they understand the respect accorded them or not. Likewise, Cristians are taught to treat the stranger as ones neighbor. This doesn't make everyone a Christian, either. - UtherSRG 01:55, 18 Jul 2004 (UTC)

Capitalism and communism are both religions. Look at the attitudes during the Cold War regarding them. Both are extremely secular, to the point that they have become secular religions. Capitalism holds "capital" sacred. Communism holds sacred its ideal philosophy. What was the Great Leap Forward but blind worship? What is the stock market but supernatural? The Great Depression was entirely driven by belief in that imagined entity. Today, capitalism and communism decide the lives and deaths of everyone in the world.

The ultimate goal of Buddhism is to bring an end to the cycle of suffering. The Four Noble Truths all but explicity state their implications. All must act for the ultimate good. Learning to do so requires understanding of the Noble Eightfold Path. If religions are to truly strive for completeness and the good of all, there is no choice but that they converge to Buddhism. --Eequor 02:57, 18 Jul 2004 (UTC)