Talk:Dutch (disambiguation)

From Academic Kids

Whoever created this disambiguation page didn't bother fixing the numerous now-broken links to the two meanings. I will try to fix these as I have time and I encourage anyone else to help out if they have time. --maveric149

Why is dutch offensive for some in the netherlands? If that is the case, why they still sing in their national anthem: duitse blood? or something like that? So, anything that sound a bit german is offensive for some dutch? Might be true, but than they maybe should change the text of their national anthem as well.

Fact is the netherland were part of middle age germany and the language was the same until the later middle ages. Only after that it became a seperate language and a seperate people.

Fact is you are wrong. Please read the article before making such statements. Dutch is not a derative of German (not todays german anyway, but altdeutsch). As for the Anthem, the text is "Duitschen bloed", 'Duitschen' a variant of 'Diets', not 'Deutsch'. Dutch is offensive because it is the English form of old Netherlandic 'Diets', which was used by nazis (the nazis used and abused many words. Thats why many think "grossdeutschland" was invented by the nazis. Actually its originally from the 1848 revolution) to promote the fictional pan-Germanic heritage of the Netherlands and Germany. Also, it implies that the Netherlands is but a part of Germany, and that the Netherlandic language is a German dialect, which is not the case. Netherlandic dialects diverged from the Germanic tree long before most German dialects did. — Jor (Talk) 20:38, 21 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Dutch is also the niederdeutsche word (a northern german dialect) for "Deutsch". So i am not completly wrong. I did not say that dutch is a dialect of german. It is not. It can't because it has its own written language. What i said is that dutch was (past) a german dialect in the middle ages. Or maybe the other way around. In the middle ages it was the same language.

But you didnt explained why they find "dutch" offensive but not "duitsch". If dutch is the english word for "diets" and "diets" a variant of "Duitsch" than they must be offended with "duitsch" as well. That is the logical conclusion, isn't it?

Refering to the germanic (germanische!!! nicht deutsche) heritage is not too fictional. The bataver were a germanic tribe. It is not a german problem that "german" is the english word of "deutsch", so the english often cant distinguish between the "ancient" germanic tribes and germans.

My point is if you state in the article: "They are offended by the term "dutch"", than you maybe should explain it. Knowbody except dutch would know why. I didn't. Maybe some germans would rather be called bavarians or saxons. But stating something that knowbody knows why is absurd.

If, than put a link and explain it.

Besides, the english called the dutch, dutch long before hitler was even born. So, only because the nazis used or rather misused that term, they should just rename everything. I think your point of view is rather absurde.

Maybe the germans should also rename all words with führer in it: like Lokführer, Reiseführer, lol.

As far as I know, dutch people aren't offended by the therm dutch( and I am dutch, so I should know) The english word for the language spoken in germany is german, and I have never heard of the therm Duitsch in english. however, the dutch word for german is Duits. I do know, that since our anthem is very old (+- 500 jears old) spelling wasn't solid in that time. In most versions it Dietsen bloed is said, but since diets is an archaic therm, modern Dutch versions all state Duits instead of Diets. Diets means "of the people". There is a lot of debate wether the song says of german blood or of normal blood(of the people). Both are reasonable possibilities. William of orange had german roots, and the song was wrote for William of nassau. But William wrote the song to get to the normal people and create a bonding feeling. Of course, peasants would support William more eagerly if he acknowledged his normal blood. In modern politics, get closer to the people. The same reason why Bush kept its Texan accent. So I think that that part should be deleted or at least improved. anyone disagree?

• Indeed -- the word "Dutch" is not considered offensive by Dutch people. The alternative that was mentioned in the previous revision, "Netherlandic", is definitely not a existing word. There exists a word "Netherlandish" (according to the Van Dale English-Dutch dictionary). However, that word is rarely used, and certainly not as an alternative to the so-called 'offensive' Dutch. Therefore I have removed the remark about Dutch being offensive. Guus 18:04, Aug 28, 2004 (UTC)

the people

There should be a separate page for the Dutch people. Instances of Dutch when referring to people should not be disambiguated. --Joy [shallot] 21:47, 24 Oct 2004 (UTC)

Pennsylvania Dutch

Dutch in Pennsylvania Dutch comes from "deutsch" (the german word for german and german language), not from "dutch". Pennsylvania Dutch is a relative to the german language, see Pennsylvania German or Pennsylvania German language. (Hypnosekröte) 84.137.239.107 13:06, 31 Mar 2005 (UTC)