Talk:Aristocracy
From Academic Kids
"This inevitably means those with the power to hold wealth and to define who remains in poverty - or, often, slavery. " is this fact or opinion? Is this sentence well-formed?
Again, Aristotle says that Oligarchy is when a few rule and they are wealthy. Aristocracy means rule of the BEST. No understanding of the Greek and this is all botched. The whole political section of Wikipedia is AWFUL.WHEELER 14:13, 8 Apr 2004 (UTC)
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Rousseau's Definition
It should be noted that Rousseau gives Aristocracy the rather neutral definition of a government "confined to the hands of a few, so that there are more ordinary citizens than there are magistrates." This is true of many republics, certainly. Does aristocracy really have a requirement of wealth or higher status?
Needs to be redone
This whole article needs to be heavily edited as it has an anti-aristocratic POV. --Daniel C. Boyer 16:18, 19 Oct 2004 (UTC)
Aristocracy
Proponents of aristocracy often mistake it for its logically consistent cousin, meritocracy.
How does something this bad get into Wikipedia? I have tried to rewrite it with something approaching neutrality.
Heredity
Shouldn't the article mention the connotation of heredity or inheritance associated with aristocracy?
--Pariah 08:56, Mar 7, 2005 (UTC)
Yes, it should, and I thought I had, but in rereading it, the heredity part was understated to the point of being abtuse. I have tried again. Perhaps the changes address the issue more directly. Johnwhunt 13:42, 7 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- I think that gets the point across, although the idea of heritable leadership seems to extend more broadly than the UK--perhaps we can add a link to the term dynasty? or am I pushing the bounds of the technical definition? Anyway--the new one is definitely better.--Pariah 23:05, Mar 7, 2005 (UTC)
Unexplained revert
John, please explain why you reverted. Adhib 09:19, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- In the absence of such reasoning, I propose to continue enlarging the article along the lines I was establishing previously. Please do not revert these further edits without explanation.Adhib 10:39, 18 Mar 2005 (UTC)
- Daniel's rv appeared to be in objection to a link I added to Trustafarian. I've restored the paragraph he appears to have accidentally excised, minus the Trustafarian link. Adhib 20:44, 3 Apr 2005 (UTC)
Virtually a definition of Wikipedia's "NPOV"
"Aristocrat as a pejorative term is intended to indicate that a person has achieved status by accident of birth, not merit - ie, a person whose unearned status is an affront to the bourgeois or liberal norms of meritocracy." Brilliant! (It does seem pointless to edit here.) --Wetman 01:49, 4 May 2005 (UTC)
- Anyone may judge whether "aristocrat" is actually a pejorative simply by applying the adjective "aristocratic" to a range of nouns and judging the result: "aristocratic bearing, aristocratic face, aristocratic shoes, aristocratic attitude... This person simply wants aristocratic to be pejorative because she thinks it ought to be. Look at the revealing usage of "norms". --Wetman 18:04, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
I did not write this text so I cannot speak to the author's intent but my gloss is as follows:
- The paragraph speaks only of the use of "artistocrat" in a perjorative sense. It makes no claims about its neutral use.
- It asserts that meritocracy is a bourgeois or liberal norm; that is, a norm of the bourgeoisie or of liberal philosophy.
As far as I can see the paragraph is entirely correct but not correctly entire. To my mind it can be fixed as follows:
- An aristocrat is a member of the aristocracy. "Aristocrat" may also be used as a pejorative term to indicate that a person has achieved status by accident of birth rather than by merit—such unearned status being an affront to the bourgeois or liberal norms of meritocracy.
--Theo (Talk) 18:59, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
- Good job, Theo Clarke! I've returned the edited text to the article. Thank you. --Wetman 19:31, 19 May 2005 (UTC)
hey
Insert non-formatted text herehey people whats up? tell me info about a aristocray i dont heckk about it!! lol
